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Episode Description
Do you struggle with anxiety, low confidence, procrastination, perfectionism, or people-pleasing? Me too. In this episode, I’m chatting with Daniel Packard, who has taken a unique approach to ridding ourselves of these issues. During our thought-provoking discussion, we cover the real cause behind these issues and why traditional mental health approaches have failed to provide lasting solutions. The solution may surprise you.
Discover how Daniel’s led to a paradigm shift in understanding and treating these common afflictions that many lawyers deal with daily. Don’t miss this career-changing, possibly life-altering episode that challenges everything you thought you knew about mental health in the legal profession.
Hit play now to uncover the truth and take the first step towards a more confident, productive, and fulfilling legal career.
Episode Resources
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Connect with Daniel on LinkedIn
Episode Transcript
DANIEL: [00:00:00] You can’t outrun this. You can try to white knuckle it. It eventually it’s going to catch up with you.
LAUREN: Welcome to a different practice. I’m your host, Lauren Lester, and I’m obsessed with all things business well being and optimizing the practice of law for solo and small firm lawyers. I started my solo practice right out of law school, built it from the ground up, and now work part time while earning well over six figures.
I’m here to share tangible, concrete tools and resources for ditching the legal profession’s antiquated approach and building a law practice optimized for profit and efficiency. Think of this as grabbing coffee with your work bestie mixed with everything they didn’t teach you in law school about running a business.
Pull up a seat, grab a cup, and get ready to be encouraged and challenged. This is a different practice.
Hey everyone, welcome to a different practice. We’ve got a good episode today, a little bit different, a little different of a topic, but still a [00:01:00] very good one. First though, let me ask you a question. Do you struggle with anxiety, low self confidence, procrastination, perfectionism, or people pleasing? Did you raise your hand for all of them like me?
Yeah, I’m in the same boat. I’ve certainly found over the years that therapy and books and videos and even podcasts have been really helpful in getting a better understanding of what causes these stressors, why I exhibit them, and even some ways to reduce them. I think this is probably true for most of us in the profession, whether you’re in private practice or not.
But certainly for those of us who have taken the entrepreneurial leap, who have launched our own businesses, who are running our own businesses, I think that these stressors become more exacerbated. We can feel them a lot more. And oftentimes, feel really isolated. We think that we’re the only ones. I know I have thought this, you know, it’s just me who’s really struggling.
Everybody else externally looks [00:02:00] like they’ve got it all figured out. So it can feel really isolating and lonely, and it can also feel like something that’s just part of the job that we all just have to deal with, that when we sign up for this entrepreneurial life, it comes with it. And so we find ways to manage it.
We find escapes, some of which may not be the most healthy, but we do the best that we can with what we’ve got. But over the last couple of years, for me personally, I’ve really started to wonder if it has to be a part of the job. If that really is the case, or if we have just learned that behavior, and if there is a way to be able to practice without those stressors, without anxiety, without low confidence, without that perfectionism or people pleasing that’s constantly nagging at us.
So in the conversation today, we’re going to hear from somebody who believes that instead of managing it, we can actually be free from these things once and for all. My guest [00:03:00] today is Daniel Packard. He is a mechanical engineer whose company Full Liberation Technology spent eight years and over a million dollars in research and development to reverse engineer an innovative system that’s helped thousands of people live happier lives.
By being free of what holds them back quickly and permanently. You may be thinking how the heck is an engineer able to help people be happier, or even what is an engineer doing on a podcast for lawyers? Well, I was super intrigued too. And I think that his unique approach to the issue is something worth considering and listening to.
I always like to hear from outside perspectives. I think that it helps. So I’m hopeful that this conversation with Daniel will help shed some light on the issue that a lot of us are struggling with. Don’t forget, you can share your thoughts using the new commenting feature on Spotify for this particular episode or any other episode.
Or you can leave a voice message by using the link in the show [00:04:00] notes. I’d love to hear what you think after you listen! So let’s jump in. Here’s my conversation with Daniel Packard. Welcome Daniel to a different practice.
DANIEL: Thank you, Lauren. I love the name, and my mom was a lawyer, so I, I got a front row seat to see, you know, what that life is like and the challenges that it has, and what I do right now, I was definitely born to do, but I, I’ve been told by many people that I should have been a lawyer because I’m, I, I’m, and I’ll say this, I am a darn good arguer because I stick to the facts.
I lay out my arguments and I used to have a friend. He’s like, ah, you’re always right. And I said, are you saying that, that you’re just frustrated that you never get to be right? Or you think I’m wrong, but I think I’m right. He said, no, you’re always right. And I, I don’t like it. [00:05:00] And I, I went, okay, what do you want me to do?
Be wrong? And he said, what, what do you do? And I said, well, I don’t make a point until I’ve got facts. Lined up in a logical argument where I’m not right. The facts just present themselves in such a way. It’s like, God, that sounds effective. Why can’t I do that? I was like, I don’t know. But anyway, I appreciate what lawyers do and I think they’re very needed.
And I also can imagine the stress and the pressures that they have. And so it feels meaningful to be sharing what I’m going to be sharing with your audience. And I always like to be clear about what our company does that’s valuable and rare and effective because there’s a lot of podcasts and your audience are busy people and their time is valuable.
So I like to be clear what we do because it’s not typical and it’s innovative and it’s most important, most importantly effective. So since most people are conditioned for things that don’t work, I like to be very clear in what we do. And [00:06:00] what we do is very simply. What everyone else isn’t doing what most people are offering.
So if, if you’re a lawyer or you are a lawyer and own a law firm, then that means that you’re already successful. You’ve done well, you’re smart. You know how to work hard. You pass the bar. You’re functioning and maybe even succeeding, but almost always in all humans, but especially in successful people, you’ll get one of what we call the funky five in our company.
The funky five is either anxiety, perfectionism, people pleasing, procrastination, or some version of low confidence and low confidence doesn’t necessarily mean you’re a weak, shy wallflower. You know, you may be, most lawyers will have a level of confidence in certain areas, you can’t be an insecure. Lawyer, however, caring what people think of you, needing people to like you, not always being fully authentic, doubting yourself.
These are forms of low competence. So usually [00:07:00] most people struggle with one or multiples of the funky five. And if they go looking for help, they’ll go to a therapist or a psychologist or a spiritual teacher or a coach or a guru or, and what they’ll usually get, which is what is on the market is usually a tip.
Or a tool or some insights and awareness that at best are going to help you manage it. And management is certainly better than nothing. When things get really bad, you have a tool to kind of manage it, but it’s not gone. You’re not free of it. And when you’re not free of it, you can’t fully enjoy life completely.
If you have anxiety and you’re managing it, you can’t be anxious and enjoying work at the same time. You can be anxious and get work done, but you won’t enjoy it. Or if you’re have low confidence, you can push through it, but you’re not as authentic. You’re not as confident. And it just holds people back from being happier, from being promoted.
It affects their earning potential because people get into their comfort zone, so they’re [00:08:00] making okay money, but they’re not really doing what they love. So short answer is if this resonates with you, what we developed over eight years, and I’ll tell you how we did it. We spent eight years and a million dollars in musician development to develop a system and the keyword, a system that allows you to be free of.
One or multiples of the funky five, which again, anxiety, procrastination, people pleasing, perfectionism, and low confidence. And it’s gone. And when it’s gone, you enjoy work more. You’re better at what you do. You make more money. And you’re just a better person for yourself in the world around you. So for you lawyers out there that I know if everyone whatever you’re if you’re listening to this right now in your lawyer You’re already successful But if you’d like to be more successful More happy in more areas of your life So you’re not a elite lawyer who’s also going home to a bunch of cats and an overpriced duvet cover I’m, not naming names I’m, just saying that’s what this is if you want to be free of this to really be happier and fulfill your potential that You [00:09:00] That’s
LAUREN: one of the reasons I wanted to chat today because I feel like it is almost a requirement of our profession that we have certainly anxiety that we feel that lack of confidence because there’s a certain box and a mold that a lot of attorneys feel like they have to fit into so they can’t show up authentically.
And I know certainly for me and you know, my fellow legal entrepreneurs, there’s a lot of fear and doubt about jumping off the cliff and doing something that is for ourselves and maybe a little bit more innovative. And it does feel to me that we fall into this trap that if you do not have the badge of burnout, you are not a successful attorney and I just can’t get behind that.
I know that’s what it feels like in our profession and I’m sure a lot of the listeners have, have felt that pressure against them, but that can’t be how it is. That just logically doesn’t make sense to [00:10:00] me. So I wanted to have you bring us an outside perspective and start by just sharing. Where do those funky five come from?
Are they the culture of a profession? Are they societal? Are they in our DNA as humans? Like, how does that come to be? And when they are enhanced by a profession, I’m imagining that that can be even more detrimental and harder to break out of that cycle.
DANIEL: Well, it’s a really good question. And it’s a question I had because I wasn’t a lawyer, but I, I was successful in what I was doing.
I’m smart. I knew how to work hard and I was successful. I also was anxious. I cared what people thought of me. I was out of balance. I was codependent. I was an overthinker, had self doubt. I mean, I was just, was your typical successful person who’s successful, but not fully fulfilled and happy because these things slow you down or stop you.
There’s no way around it. I went [00:11:00] looking for help. I wanted to be a better me. I wanted to look in the mirror and love who I saw. I didn’t want to, you know, the beauty of success. And I heard this from a very wise person. They said, success won’t make you happy. However, there’s a beauty in success and that, you know, that success doesn’t make you happy.
And he said, it’s quite well documented that many, many sort of saints and gurus were formerly wealthy. And this is sort of secondhand the way he said, he said, if you walk up to a poor person who has nothing and says, money won’t buy you happiness, they’re going to say, Go F yourself. I’m hungry. I don’t have a roof.
Don’t tell me money won’t make me happier, but once you’ve had the money and you’ve had the success and you look around and you’re like, wow, I’m not feeling a whole lot better. In fact, I might even be feel worse. You now have this experience, which is a luxury to go, Oh, maybe, maybe I need to go deeper and figure this out.
You know, many people don’t, right. They get to a certain level of success as [00:12:00] I did. Wasn’t feeling any better, wasn’t any happier. And instead of waking up going, wait a minute, maybe I’m trapped in this paradigm. I just thought, well, maybe I need to be a little bit more successful. Then of course you get more success.
I didn’t feel any better. I felt worse. So it wasn’t until usually what’ll happen is, The pain becomes unbearable. It can be burnout. It can be anxiety turns to panic attacks. It can be But we see this with a lot. I mean, I just had a woman from south africa who ran her own law firm And you know smart successful And everything I was telling her she said yeah I was functioning away with it and then the anxiety went from occasionally to all the time and then it went to panic attacks And so that’s what’s going to happen.
You can’t outrun this. You can try to white knuckle it, and eventually it’s going to catch up with you. So, I went looking for help, and I went to the psychologists, and therapists, and gurus, and coaches, and apps, and I spent 10 years trying to be free of this stuff [00:13:00] and 100, 000, and it was never gone, Lauren.
I had some tips and tools to manage it, to white knuckle it, to push through it. And I still just wasn’t happy. I wasn’t the person I wasn’t. I didn’t want to be. I wasn’t fulfilled. I wasn’t joyful. And I was like, what’s the point of being successful if you’re not happy? Like the whole video game of life is just to feel good.
I don’t care who you are. We want to feel good. We want to be happy. And I saw that, I call it the improvement industrial complex. It’s a trillion dollar industry global with a T. Trillion. Therapy, psychology, and spirituality, and coaching. Trillion dollars a year. And when we did our research, we saw, as far as we know, nobody is solving this stuff quickly and completely.
And not measurably you’ve got management, but I just saw this industry is not getting great results, results matter. And results matter to me. Cause when I was growing up, my dad told me he was a [00:14:00] physicist, but he can have a theory or an idea. That’s easy. He said, but you know, the person who knows what they’re talking about, who gets results, lawyers, the person who has, who wins the case more consistently, we can assume they’re usually a better lawyer.
They get better results. You got to respect results. And I just saw that therapy, psychology, spirituality, coaching didn’t get phenomenal results. They got some results, but it wasn’t getting people free of this, and not quickly, not measurably. So I was trained as a mechanical engineer, UC Berkeley, and I was trained how to solve things and get things that work and get results.
And it’s a certain approach to things, problem solving and innovation. It’s a, it’s a, it’s a, it’s a different breed of person. People who go after solutions and stay focused and innovate, you know, Edison, it was a thousand light bulbs before he got it. Most people don’t do a thousand. Most people give up around 27 and then go Netflix and chill.
The Wright brothers. [00:15:00] built the first plane that eventually flew. And it took them four years of just daily tweaking, optimizing for years, day in, day out. And then the plane flies. Most people aren’t built for that. Engineers are built for that. We love to see a problem, go at it. As long as it takes till we innovate.
So I started my own research company to see, could we innovate an approach to human happiness and reverse engineer a system such that if you work the steps in the right order, you would get the result. And the result is that what you’re struggling with is gone. Freedom, not management, not insights, not awareness gone.
You know, when you break your bone, you go in, they put on a cast eight weeks later, it’s solved. Why can’t we do that for the things that we struggle with? So it took eight years. It took a million dollars in research and development. I worked with addicts in South Africa. I worked with entrepreneurs in [00:16:00] Europe.
I worked with athletes in the U S we worked with 3000 people. Total focused on this solution to get people. free of this stuff quickly because results matter. That’s what my dad said. So I bring it up because when you’re in pain and you’re struggling, you want results. Your lawyers, you are hired to get results.
You’re not hired to give your clients awareness. Nobody said, Oh, I’d like to give you awareness about your case. I’d like to give you awareness of no, get me a result. So results matter. So when we work with people, they do not pay at the beginning. Because we haven’t gotten you a result yet. You pay us at the end when you have clear measurable data.
We measure you as you go through the program. You measure on our app. And at the end, when you’re free of it, that’s when you pay. And we do that because if we can’t help you, we’re not gonna charge you. It’s not right. And, and many lawyers do it this way, right? They work on, they get a percentage of the outcome.
Which is nice! It’s [00:17:00] saying, look, we’ll take on the risk. And you pay us if we win. And it’s, there’s a certain integrity to that. And we brought that to human happiness because we’re tired of these people taking people’s money and leaving them feeling more broken and trapped. So that’s sort of how we ended up here.
Now I’ll explain to you. More of the theory that answers your question of kind of like, why do people do these patterns? But I wanted to explain sort of how we ended up here that I didn’t just, you know, wake up on a park bench one day and be like, Ooh, I got it. No, we were engineers and we went at this hard eight years to innovate.
a solution so people could live happier. So it’s a really good question. And the question that you’re asking points to the main problem. And by that, I mean, what we discovered and people say, well, how do you get people free of this in six weeks? They think it’s something new and magical because the results are next level.
So people are assuming it’s something. [00:18:00] Fancy, like, well, what is it? Did you find out that there’s like some, you know, is it a psychedelic frog? Is it, you know, what, and, and actually, if you look at history, most innovations. are pretty simple, but you have to go find them. If you walk up to a guy or a woman that fishes with a fishing pole and a hook, and they catch two fish a day, and then you walk up and you say, I can help you catch 50 fish a day.
They’ll be like, what? Are you, are you a wizard? Are you from the future? And it’s like, no, it’s a net. It’s really simple. But if you don’t have an, if no one invented a net, it’s, so what we figured out is, Simple. Now, why does that matter and how does that really back your question? You just asked, is it this?
Is it that? Is it this? Is it that? And you are asking from the place that everybody is at, which is they don’t have any effing idea. People don’t know. We know if you want to lose weight, you burn more [00:19:00] calories than you eat. We know to brush and floss. We know that if you want to have a garden, you water it.
There’s a lot of things we know the basics when it comes to happiness and why we don’t put people have no idea. And the reason they have no idea is because the experts don’t know how to solve this. So there’s all these theories. Is it your childhood? Is it societal? Is it genetic? Is it trauma? The fact there’s so many theories and none of them solve anything is the problem with the industry.
This is why people are so confused and they’re stuck is because nobody knows a simple understanding. But there are simple understandings of many things on this planet. So when we approached this, we said, well, first of all, we got to simplify this. Because the simpler your understanding is, probably the more you understand something better.
When Newton came up with his, Newton’s laws of motion, that was like, I think it’s three, three laws or four laws, three laws. And then he had the equation for gravity. He, all, almost all of [00:20:00] motion is described very simply. You gotta be pretty smart to come up with that. Einstein equals MC squared. One equation blew the doors off.
So when you can make something simple, you really understand it. So we first looked at the whole industry and we said, this is unnecessarily complicated and nobody’s solving anything. I bet they don’t understand simply what’s going on. So we said, let’s just make this simple. So we stepped back and we looked and said, all right, let’s make, let’s first simplify this.
And the first thing we did is we made it simple. So I’m going to make it really simple. All the other things, childhood, conditioning, biology, gender, society, all that stuff is not the root cause. Once things go south, it might contribute. It might make it worse. It’s not the root cause. Do you want to know what the root cause is?
It’s going to be simple and it’s going to be obvious. It feels like we have all these different problems because that’s what we’re told. Oh, I have procrastination. I’m a people [00:21:00] pleaser. Oh, I have low self esteem. I’m a perfectionist. It makes it seem like there’s these different problems that we’re plagued with.
Now, that’s a good business model if you want to keep people scared and you want to make a lot of money. You tell people there’s all these problems and you never solve their problems. It’s a really good business model. It’s just not true to your listeners. You do not have multiple problems. You have multiple symptoms of one simple thing, which is fear.
That’s it. You can call it anxiety, or you could say you’re just feeling really afraid. And when that fear feeling gets high enough, you call it anxious. It’s fear. You could say you’re a procrastinator, but really you’re afraid to start or finish things. You could say you’re a perfectionist, or you could say you have a fear of making a mistake.
It’s You could say you’re a people pleaser or you could say you have a fear that people won’t like you So you want everyone to be happy? And you could say you have low confidence or you could [00:22:00] say you have a fear of being fully authentic So, can you see there’s not all these problems. There’s one thing there’s fear Showing up in multiple different ways
If you brought a hundred lawyers into a room, which sounds like the setup for a joke, But if you brought a hundred lawyers into a room and you said what are you struggling with? Well, I’m struggling with this I’m struggling with that. It’ll show up in these different ways with these different names, negative mindset, sabotage But if you just simplified it and I said what if everybody’s just afraid and it’s showing up in all these different ways Would you kind of say yeah, that kind of makes sense?
Doesn’t it just make sense? People who sabotage. Sabotage is just a fancy word for you’re afraid something’s going to happen so you blow it up before it can happen. It’s fear. So first of all, to your audience, you do not have multiple problems. You have fear for reasons which I’ll explain. And then it’s showing up in all these different ways.
That’s it. [00:23:00] And can you see that no matter what you call it, if you’re afraid, your ability to be an effective lawyer consistently is going to go down.
LAUREN: And to run a business effectively.
DANIEL: Yeah. We are wired to stay alive. And to get away from fear. That will always win. Because that’s how we’re wired. Yes, we’re kind of smart, but we’re also built just like monkeys to stay alive.
So if anything creates fear, that’s going to get priority over what’s smart, intelligent, or strategic. Fear grabs a hold of you, and the fear will almost always win. When it wins, whatever it is you truly want to be doing, or what would be best for you or the business or others get to put secondary because we’re not wired to put those things first.
We’re wired to get the hell away from fear, including staying in a comfort zone, including not speaking up, including violating your integrity, including getting nervous, fear will always. keep you from what you truly want to be doing and showing up.
LAUREN: Is there a [00:24:00] good thing about fear? I certainly understand it being the root of all of these things.
Is there a benefit to it? Does it cause us to pause in a good way? Obviously not sitting in it and using it as an excuse, I understand, but are there some benefits to having that fear?
DANIEL: Well, it’s a good question. And people have asked me, they’ll say, you know what, I function better when I’m anxious. You know, if you take away my anxiety, that’s my competitive advantage.
And I’m like, right. So anything can have a benefit. Okay. That’s like saying, well, isn’t cocaine kind of a good idea? Cause it gives me energy. I’m like, I, I guess. But it’s not a good life strategy. You could argue that your intuition, which tells you not to do certain things, which with a low level of cautionary concern is healthy.
But if something is truly out of balance and [00:25:00] unhealthy, a high level of fear. Is not helpful. Now it is motivating. Parents know this an unrefined parent can scare the crap out of a kid and motivate fears. A great motivator. Anybody who’s used a gun knows it. So fear can motivate a person. So your lawyers will use the fear.
And it will motivate them. It’s a phenomenal motivator. You’re trying to avoid this thing. However, the question is, are you doing your best work and is it sustainable? If you were only going to be a lawyer for a week and you wanted to get a bunch of stuff done, sure. Scare the crap out of yourself and maybe get a bunch of stuff done.
But when you’re afraid your cognition goes down. And also when you’re afraid it’s exhausting. It takes a lot of energy to be afraid, to overthink, to have self doubt, to be a perfectionist. I work with a lot of entrepreneurs that are perfectionists. They’re just spinning, spinning, spinning, spinning. It’s exhausting and ineffective.
Could one [00:26:00] make a case where, yes, fear has always been there? An occasional, an advantage from one layer, sure. But from a holistic, high performance, sustainability perspective, no, it’s not a good idea.
LAUREN: So then how do we make a change? What’s the biggest hurdle that holds folks back? Because this very much makes sense, but I’m assuming that there’s still a fear that folks don’t take the next step.
So what are those steps to help remove that?
DANIEL: Well, it’s a good question. And it goes back to. How little we understand, look, your audience doesn’t need me to tell them they’re afraid. I mean, maybe yes, I brought a little bit of clarity, said, look, it’s at the root of everything, but like your audience already knows they’re afraid.
They know fear holds them back. Anyone who’s high school student knew what it was like to be insecure. And, you know, I had pimples and thought I was unlovably ugly and insecure, whatever you call it. You don’t need me to tell you fear is the issue, but here’s what’s fascinating. We figured out the root cause of fear and how to get rid of it.
[00:27:00] But if I asked you, Hey, Lauren, and if I asked your audience, how do you permanently get rid of fear quickly? Do you know how? No. No! Nobody knows! Number one problem on the planet, you can call it anxiety. It also leads to addiction. All the violence we see in the world, underneath violence is fear. Our whole world, where we’re like, why are people acting so crazy?They’re afraid underneath, and when you’re afraid, you’re just not a very good person. The number one thing affecting our planet, the average person has no effing idea. And that’s because the experts didn’t take the time to figure it out. Experts will tell you overcome the fear, face the fear, reframe the fear, change your mindset around the fear.
Okay. But if you overcome the fear, the fear is still there. So we’re engineers. We were like, we just need to solve this fear thing. We solve the fear thing. The symptoms go away. Do you want to know how to solve the fear thing?
LAUREN: Yes.
DANIEL: Do you want an answer that’s complicated or simple?
LAUREN: Very [00:28:00] simple. Simple.
Simple.
DANIEL: All right, you’re sure? Because we can make this all complicated and you can get stuck in a hamster wheel of analysis for 15 years thinking. No,
LAUREN: thank you. I’ve lived there already. Yes.
DANIEL: Okay. Now again, we discovered this because we were incentivized to solve this. We weren’t experts regurgitating old antiquated information that doesn’t solve anything.
We started from scratch trying to solve things. And that’s a different mindset. And we looked at things mechanically. Mechanically is very different than spiritual or psychological. Mechanical is what you want if you want a fast, effective solution. If you’re choking and I, and two people walk up to you and one person says, Hey, I noticed you’re struggling.
I think you have a real negative mindset around breathing. Like, I think you’re really focusing on the lack of breath you have instead of like the abundance of air that’s out there. And also I feel like your ego. is really attached to breathing and living and if you could like let go of that attachment and just see how great you [00:29:00] could be and you don’t need the air girlfriend you’re an independent woman or someone walks up and says look here’s the deal this is a mechanical issue you have a piece of chipotle blocking your windpipe and it’s mechanical i’m going to add mechanical pressure to your stomach which will put air behind the chipotle and pop it out and then you’ll be able to mechanically get air into your lungs and about 10 seconds from now you’ll hopefully be breathing If you’re struggling and you want a fast, effective solution, do you want an understanding that’s psychological, spiritual, or mechanical?
LAUREN: Mechanical.
DANIEL: Why?
LAUREN: Cause it gets results faster.
DANIEL: Yes. Do you struggle with one or multiples of the funky five, Lauren?
LAUREN: Of course! Yeah.
DANIEL: Okay, did you ever get a mechanical explanation of how to be free of it?
LAUREN: No.
DANIEL: No, that’s why you’re stuck. That’s why you still have it. To your audience, the reason you still have these patterns, you’re not broken.
There’s nothing wrong with you. You’re not flawed. The experts, while well intentioned, were ill equipped. To solve these things because they didn’t understand the root cause [00:30:00] and they didn’t understand it in a way that was solution. That’s why you’re stuck We want people unstuck. So here’s where the fear comes from.
It’s real simple First of all, we went to the correct location of the fear. What do I mean by that? Well, your average therapist spiritual teacher or coach will tell you Well, I’ll ask you, if I, if I said, based on what you’ve learned in your years of just paying attention to all the theories and the ideas, and I said, where do you think fear originates?
What would be your answer? Lauren?
LAUREN: The brain.
DANIEL: Right. That’s the answer that you’re told. Fear is a problem of the mind. Change your mindset. Stop your scarcity thinking. Quiet your ego. Don’t believe the thoughts in your head. False evidence appearing real. And it’s even called mental health. It’s got the word mental right in there.
So everybody’s told this is a problem of the mind. Now the mind is a problem. The mind can be nasty and say mean things. I used to, my mind used to tell me I was unlovable, ugly, [00:31:00] which is really kind of mean. Ugly is mean. Unlovable is mean, unlovable, ugly. And then I was insecure. So I got my mind telling me I’m unlovable, ugly.
I feel insecure and ugly. So it looks like it’s the mind looks like it’s a theory. There’s just one problem. That theory, that fear, and these problems originate in the mind. Does that theory get great results? No, you’re in a hamster wheel. Modern psychology has been around a hundred years. Anxiety is on the rise.
Addictions on the rise. Self harm on young girls is up 150%. And also the father of modern psychology was Freud. He was a chain smoking, cocaine addict. Like this theory of understanding the mind doesn’t get the job done. So it could be true. It’s just not true. Cause if it was true, they would have solved it.
Fear and these things, they do not originate in the mind. They originate in the body. Which actually just makes sense. Do you say, I feel fear or I think fear?
LAUREN: I [00:32:00] feel fear. Do
DANIEL: you say, I think anxious or I feel anxious?
LAUREN: Feel anxious.
DANIEL: Yeah. And listen to the words. Throat, when you feel it, where do we feel the fear and the anxiety and the worry?
Throat, chest, heart, stomach. Does that sound like the mind to you or the body? Now, sometimes people say, well, yeah, Daniel, but my, my mind says scary things and it spreads to the body. That’s what you’re told. And if that worked and got results, great. It doesn’t. But also, it’s not mechanical. You’re wired where your body senses what your body needs to stay alive.
Then your mind, secondarily, is a tool that senses what the signals in the body says, and then the mind is a little computer that tries to get the body what it needs. You feel hunger in the body first. Then the mind senses the hunger, and then the mind tries to figure out where to get food. If you’re out, you know, in the jungle and you hear a sound in the jungle, you feel fear in the body.
First, the [00:33:00] mind senses that fear. And then the mind tries to solve the problem, the threat. So for reasons which I’ll explain, your body is feeling afraid, but now there’s no threat. But the mind doesn’t know that. The mind thinks there’s a threat because it feels fear in the body. So the mind starts spinning.
Oh my God, there’s a problem. There’s a problem with you. You better figure this out. What if it goes wrong? What if you make a mistake? What if people don’t like you? And it starts spinning, trying to figure out why you’re afraid. So it starts to spin, which keeps you in this loop of fear, which we call the spin cycle.
So the mind ain’t helping, but it’s not the root cause. It starts in the body and spreads to the mind. And this is in theory. When we started developing our system, I was one of the early test cases and we built a set of tools just focused on the body. Not only did my body calm down, I remember waking up one morning about eight years ago and I just felt calm.
And at first I thought it was temporary. I thought, oh, there’s no way this is [00:34:00] permanent. Next day, I’m calm. Day after that, I’m calm. Then people started doing the things that used to make me insecure and doubt myself. Didn’t affect me. I’ve been calm in the body for eight years straight. For But in addition to that, my mind just went quiet.
It’s not scared anymore. So there’s no nothing to solve. So my mind just chills. And when my mind does talk, it says nice things. I mean, I’m getting older. I’m losing my hair. I’m getting wrinkles. I’m not making this up. I looked in the mirror this morning and I was like, I do me. I was saying nice things. So I used to tell myself I’m unlovably ugly.
Now I’m like, I adore you. Not because I changed my mind that my body is calm. We worked with a woman entrepreneur her whole life. She spent probably 15 years going to therapists, psychologists, spiritual teachers, trying to quiet her mind. And I said, it’s never going to work. She felt broken. She’s like, I have a weak mind.
What’s wrong with my mindset? I said. You were sent to the wrong location. You were sent to the symptom level, and you can’t ever get rid of a symptom. As long as your body’s afraid, your [00:35:00] mind’s gonna start spinning out of control, trying to solve a problem. She said, that makes so much sense! Because when I feel calmer, my mind is usually quieter.
And then when I feel more nervous, my mind starts spinning. I said, exactly! And she said, my mind could just be quiet. I said, yeah. She said, Oh my God, I didn’t even know that was an option. So she went through our program for both anxiety, but also perfectionism. And we saw statistically that her anxiety by about week five, her anxiety was down about 75%.
And her perfectionism was down about 85%. And again, we track this and she said, I just don’t need things to be perfect anymore. I just do my work. I do my best. I get way more done. I enjoy it more. Actually, I’m actually doing better work because the pressure and the fear of don’t make a mistake. I’m sharper.
I do better work faster with more joy to get a better result. She said, but also I feel [00:36:00] calm. And my mind is quiet and it’s beautiful. And now I’m happier. This is not theory. This is true. Fear is not coming from the mind. It’s in the body. And the reason your audience has been stuck in this hamster wheel of trying to fix this is because the expert sent you to literally the wrong place.
But as you can imagine, if you go to the correct location, the body, your results are going to get better. If you go to the right place, people say like, what, why did an engineer. Figure this out instead of a therapist or a psychologist. I said because they’re just regurgitating what they’ve been taught Which it’s in the mind so, you know people have legacy thinking and most people aren’t innovators Most people aren’t going to go to school for something spend thousands of dollars Build a practice and then start poking holes in the validity of what they do.
Most people aren’t that But we’re engineers. We’re innovators. We don’t care. What’s right. We just want what works and we innovate That’s a very different mindset So It just makes sense, but if you were trained in therapy [00:37:00] school or you had a spiritual teacher and you were told it was in the mind and that’s what you believe, you buy into that paradigm and you’re not open to seeing what’s right in front of you.
That’s why engineers are a good candidate because we’re innovators and we’re just, we’re looking at this thing, seeing what works and it makes sense. So then the question is, why is the body afraid? Now, the beauty of the body is the beauty of the body is that the body in many ways is kind of simple.
There’s just basic systems in there. A skeleton’s kind of simple. Knee is simple. Teeth are simple. The body, a lot of it’s just kind of simple and mechanical. Your lungs, air comes in, gets turned into, and the oxygen goes into the veins. It’s all mechanical and it’s all systems. Engineers love that shit.
Because it’s systems and it’s mechanical. So, we just said it. What’s the system making all the fear? It’s gotta be here somewhere. It’s really simple. Take out the word fear. Take out the word anxiety. Take out the word worry. [00:38:00] Just use the word nervous. What system in the body do you think is most likely malfunctioning and making everybody Extra nervous.
Okay. The endocrine system, the epidermal system, or the nervous system.
LAUREN: I feel so smart. I’m going to go with nervous system.
DANIEL: O M G, girlfriend. Gold stars to you and your audience. It’s the nervous system. You do not need to have a law degree or pass the bar to figure that out. Why? Because it’s got the word nervous right in the effing name.
LAUREN: Like it was a clue.
DANIEL: Yeah, and a pretty obvious one at that. You got the whole planet. Malfunctioning from different versions of feeling nervous. There’s a system in the body literally called the nervous system. We know systems in the body can malfunction and start to act funky. And after a hundred years of crappy results, the experts were like, nah, it’s the [00:39:00] mind.
No! Wake up! Pay attention! It’s the nervous system. The nervous system is your body’s natural mechanical threat response system. It’s designed to detect threats. When it detects a threat, you feel unsafe. When you feel unsafe, you feel fear. That feeling of fear is meant to get your attention so that you get away from the threat.
But that’s what the nervous system is designed to do. Detect threats, release, feel unsafe, release fear, to get your attention, to get you to safety. Nervous system. Systems in the body, when they run properly, run well. If you drink enough water, brush your teeth, food pyramid, diet exercises, systems generally run pretty well.
If you don’t know how to take care of a system, if you don’t know to brush and floss, if you never taught to sleep eight hours, if you didn’t know about diet, didn’t know about brushing and flossing, [00:40:00] brushing and flossing, that’s about a hundred years old. They didn’t know about that. People’s seed were falling out.
They didn’t know about brushing and flossing. So if you know how to take care of a system, it usually can kind of take care of itself. But if you are never taught to take care of a system, you can’t take care of it. So eventually that system will go into disrepair. Did anybody, and I say this to your audience, sit you down and say, Hey, here’s the basic daily hygiene of your nervous systems and your feelings and emotions.
The basic daily hygiene that you need to do every day. And if you don’t do this, that nervous system will malfunction. Were you ever taught how to take care of your nervous system?
LAUREN: No, to be honest, I, I feel a little embarrassed to say, I barely knew what the nervous system did. I knew it existed. But I didn’t even know the basics and definitely didn’t know how to take care of it.
DANIEL: Well, you shouldn’t be embarrassed because the symptoms showed up and everyone called it a mental health issue. So they sent you to the wrong place. You were sent to the mind. So don’t be embarrassed, but I get it. So the [00:41:00] nervous system, we were never taught to take care of it. If you’re not taught to take care of it, if the nervous system is healthy, what you’ll experience it as you feel safe.
But we were never taught to take care of it. I wasn’t. So what happens is you start to feel unsafe for no reason. Well, the reason is you’re not taking care of it. So the system is miscalibrated. You feel unsafe when you feel unsafe. You then feel fear when you feel fear. Then the funky five. Show up. So anxiety, procrastination, people pleasing, perfectionism, low self confidence, also overthinking, sabotage, addiction, you name it.
Those are symptoms of fear. The fear is a symptom of not feeling safe. Not feeling safe is a symptom of you were never taught to take care of your nervous system, and now it’s cranking out all this fear. So, the reason this is a big deal is because the number one problem, fear, it’s not your past, That didn’t help.
It’s not society. That’s not helping. [00:42:00] If you have a strong, healthy, nervous system, and I know this because this is what our clients get. This was three months ago, I’m thinking of a gentleman. He was a lawyer from London, came to us again. He, he had situational anxiety, meaning at work or in certain peak situations.
He also had low confidence, which affected his performance. He just, his marriage wasn’t healthy. Also, he just wasn’t the person he wanted to be at work. So I said, look, what if these are just different problems I’m not feeling safe. And he said, it makes a lot of sense. I haven’t felt safe since I was a kid.
I said, yeah, welcome to the club. I said, what if you could feel safe? He said, is that even an option? I said, well, if you know how to heal the nervous, he said, oh my God. Yeah. Oh, he also had procrastination. He was procrastinating. I think it was 80 minutes on average to get started on something. That went from 80 minutes down to about nine minutes.
The amount of time that he could be productive, meaning do the work that he wanted to do that mattered to him went from, I [00:43:00] think it was two hours a day up to about six hours a day and his focus time. Because when you’re nervous, it affects your focus. You can’t stay focused because you distract. Cause you’re feeling nervous.
So his focus time, meaning he could be focused and sharp and motivated, went up from 15 minutes in a row up to 90 minutes in a row. And we knew that from his data. But he also, when I spoke to him, he said, I woke up this morning and for the first time in my life, I just felt safe and I felt calm and it was glorious.
And I know this is permanent because that’s what your system does. He said, forget not being anxious and procrastinating. This just opens me up to just being the person I want to be. Nobody can function when you feel unsafe. So if I told you this isn’t about anxiety, procrastination, people pleasing, perfectionism, what if I told you, Lauren, and I’m asking your audience this, if you could just wake up every morning and you felt safe from the inside out, regardless of what’s going on in the world, how would your life be better?
LAUREN: Wow. That’s a [00:44:00] huge question. Thank you. I mean, I would imagine it has to be in so many ways. I could see it touching every aspect from the little to the big things.
DANIEL: Everything. You’re more confident. You’re more authentic. You’re like a kid kids before the fear kicks in. People ask me, what’s it like to be free of all this?
I know. I wake up every morning, calm. I don’t know how to procrastinate. I don’t know how to care what people think of me. I don’t know how to be a, it literally is gone, but most people aren’t me. Our clients know this. I tell people, remember that version of you at four or five before the fear kicked in.
Five year old Lauren probably didn’t wake up in the morning being like, okay, I’m really wanting to go to the park, but I really hope I do a good job and I hope I do an excellent performance attack. Like you weren’t thinking that way. Five year old you, you. Open hearted, confident, full of possibility, joy, in the moment, present, five year old you didn’t procrastinate and sabotage.
There’s not a five year old that says, Oh, [00:45:00] it’s my birthday. You know what? I don’t deserve it. No, that version of you is still in there. It’s just covered up because your nervous system feels unsafe and it’s gone. But that version of you is still in there. If you feel safe, the fear lifts and you get to be that childlike, open hearted, confident, positive, nice.
It
LAUREN: sounds lovely. My kids are four and six. So that is how they come to the world. So I see it every day. And it’s I think why we love kids that childlike wonder is exactly the best one of the best parts of them.
DANIEL: And they didn’t change their mindset. They don’t meditate. They don’t vision board. It’s their default because the fear hasn’t covered up yet.
So this spending all this money on coaches to learn and train. No, it’s your default setting. Just the fear keeps you from that. So that’s why this is so powerful is it’s not, it’s not self [00:46:00] improvement. You’re not developing it. You’re just removing the fear. And the best version of you comes out. Now this is all theory, but I want to give you an understanding that you can feel to make this more real.
So you can understand this. Cause right now you’re like, okay, nervous system. I didn’t take care of it, but I want to do a quick exercise so that you can feel what I’m saying to make it more real. Okay. Again, what we saw was essentially what’s causing the fear is not, is a lack of care. If you don’t take care of anything, a marriage, a child, a goldfish, a garden, a business, a body.
Every system will show symptoms of not being taken care of. So the big breakthrough we saw was lack of daily care leads to problems. Not society, not your past, a lack of daily care. We’ll do a little role play here where we will, where we’re friends. Okay? And I’m talking to you Lauren and I’m talking to your audience.
Okay, so this is a real crash course to show you, to prove to you quickly, there’s a direct mechanical link between [00:47:00] care and safety. Okay? So we’re friends, but let’s say for reasons which you don’t understand, all of a sudden, I start to treat you like crap. I mean to you, I’m critical to you. I don’t care what you want or what you need.
I actually know what you need and I don’t care. I put everybody else first and you are dead last. And when you are scared and need me. I’m not understanding, I tell you you’re broken and there’s something wrong with you, and I tell you to push through it, and when you really need me, I’m nowhere to be found.
If I treat you that way, with low care, over time, are you gonna feel safe or unsafe around me?
LAUREN: Very unsafe.
DANIEL: Yes. And the reason is, is because when care drops, it breaks trust. When you feel trust broken, you feel unsafe. So there’s a direct mechanical link between care, trust, and trust. And safety. It ain’t fancy.
It’s not, well, this doesn’t apply to me. No. If you do not take [00:48:00] care of another person, it breaks trust. Over time, enough broken trust leads to feeling unsafety. You can see it in your relationships. Is it fair to say you’re in a relationship with yourself?
LAUREN: Yes.
DANIEL: Is it fair to say that you and your audience are not always the best loving, caring friend to yourself?
LAUREN: Yes, we probably treat ourselves the way you just described treating a friend.
DANIEL: Yeah! And you didn’t need me to tell you that. We didn’t need to do a deep exploration and go, hey, remember that time when you were critical? You knew right away. You smiled and you were like, oh yeah, yep, yep. Tell me one of the things that you already know where you’re not the best, most loving friend to yourself.
LAUREN: How the voice in my head speaks to me.
DANIEL: Yeah, it’s the number one one that people know about. Everybody knows. I beat the crap out of. Oh, I’m so critical. Oh, everybody knows it. Everybody knows they’re afraid. But did you know that there was a direct mechanical link between the criticism and the fear? [00:49:00]
LAUREN: I have not thought about it.
But now that you’ve said it, that makes a lot of sense,
DANIEL: right? If I, as your friend criticize you constantly, it breaks trust. If you break trust, you don’t feel safe around me. If I criticize you all the time, would you feel safe or unsafe around me? Yeah.
LAUREN: Unsafe and we would not be friends.
DANIEL: Right. Cause you don’t feel safe around me and who wants to be criticized.
So doesn’t it mechanically make sense if you criticize yourself all the time, it break trust with you and it leaves your nervous system feeling unsafe. Doesn’t that just make sense? The fear is not society. It is not genetic. It is not the past. It’s just small acts of unhealth from you to you every day.
There’s 28 ways that we need to. Be good to ourselves that we diagnosed, but that’s what’s causing the fear. And the reason this is important is it’s not an abstract thing. It’s you to you every day, and it accumulates leaving you feeling unsafe in your own body. So the downside is. Everybody unknowingly, 10 to [00:50:00] 30 times a day, is not taking very good care of themselves.
That has been building over decades, where you now do not feel trusting in yourself, and you feel unsafe in your own body, from the little behaviors that you do every day. So it’s being reinforced every day. So you can’t get, unless you address that, which is what our program does, you’ll never be free of the fear because you’re reinforcing it every day by your daily habits.
So the downside is what’s causing the fear that’s messing everybody up is you to you every day, a small unhealthy acts. Every day. That’s the bad news. And unless you stop that, which nobody can do, we figured out how to do it in six weeks. You will always have the fear in there and you’ll always have the symptoms of fear.
That’s the bad news. But if we want to turn this around quickly, why is it good news to find out that the root cause is really just a little unhealthy acts accumulating? Why is that good news? If we want to [00:51:00] turn it around?
LAUREN: Because if we’re the problem, we can be the solution.
DANIEL: Yes, and if the problem is just little things, you can switch that.
If you daily have an unhealthy diet, a little bit, it’s going to accumulate, you’re going to gain weight. To lose weight, you do not need personal development, you do not need awakening, you do not need to change your mindset, you do not need to change your past, you just go from little acts of unhealth to health, and it accumulates.
And the fat goes away. You don’t have to understand fat. You don’t have to go in there and give a pep talk to the fat cells. No, you just go from unhealth to health and a mechanism in the body heals and you’re fine. That’s the breakthrough And that’s what our system does, is it has all the tools in one place.
It’s not the theory, it’s the breakthrough. We spent eight years to put all the tools in one place. And this is key. Your listeners have been going to coaches, therapists, psychologists, books, videos, apps, and usually they’re [00:52:00] getting one tip or tool at a time from an individual. That’s fine for management.
But usually, to rebuild a system, And overhaul it quickly and bring it back to help. You can’t have one tool. You need multiple tools that are optimized to get one job done. If you hire a contractor to rebuild your house and your contractor walks up and says, I’ve got a hammer. This hammer is amazing. I love my hammer.
It’s incredible. I got one tool. Are you going to trust that that contractor could completely rebuild your house quickly if they have one tool? Does he need a flamethrower and a tank? Or does he need optimized tools designed for house building? That’s just what works. Dentists have dentist tools. Surgeons have surgical tools.
Gardeners have gardening tools. Mechanics have mechanical tools. Optimized toolkit to get one job done. When you went looking for your help with the Funky Five, did anybody give you a complete optimized toolkit to get the job done? No, and that’s another reason your audience is stuck with this, [00:53:00] because they were set up for failure.
They were given individual management tools. They needed an optimized toolkit that works together. Also, you needed another thing. Even if you have all the tools and the ingredients for something, that’s not enough. Let’s say you had a friend who wanted to make chocolate chip cookies and someone gave them everything they needed.
The flour, the water, the sugar, the salt, the mixing bowl, the oven, everything they needed to make chocolate chip cookies. But that friend was not told how to bake. Even with all the tools in one place, can that friend make delicious, consistent chocolate chip cookies? When we go looking for help, therapists, psychologists, coaches, gurus, they hand us a tool and they’re basically like, Good luck!
They don’t tell us what to do, in what order, for what amount of time. There’s a sequence, there’s a protocol, even lawyers. There’s a way to do things in a certain order and timing to get the result. So [00:54:00] for eight years, we had the theory down. It was the toolkit. But the reason we have a 90 percent success ratio rate is because you get all the tools and then every day there’s no guessing, there’s no confusion.
You know exactly what to do. On what day, in what order, for how long? You just apply the tools, the way we’ve laid out, and if you work the steps, you get the results. And it’s basically 20 minutes a day. You apply the tools for about 5 minutes a time, when the behavior or the feeling comes up. You apply the tool for about 5 minutes.
That’s it. So can you see that by having all the tools in one place and the simple, easy to follow instructions to get the job done, can you see that it’s possible that one could heal their nervous system just like you can heal a bone, you can heal a tooth and you can heal a heart. Can you see that it’s possible?
LAUREN: Yeah, absolutely.
DANIEL: So that’s the breakthrough. If you don’t have this, what you struggle with feels [00:55:00] complicated. It feels like you’re stuck with it and the best you can do is help to manage it. But you don’t we spent eight years. It was a shit ton of work. It was passionate work. And we’ve now got a six week program and you get all the tools in one place.
Simple, easy to follow instructions. It’s very it’s designed for busy people to do. So if you’re thinking, oh, how much time? It’s not that much time per day. So it doesn’t take much time. So very busy people. Entrepreneurs do it. Lawyers do it. Doctors do it. I had a truck driver do it. Truck drivers. Those guys are driving 18 hours a day.
He did it. So, if you’re thinking, oh, well, I have enough time, yes, because we developed the system to be effective for everybody, not just for people who can sit around on a mountaintop for hours per day.
LAUREN: That was super helpful. Really insightful. If anyone is interested, where can they find out more?
DANIEL: Well, I’ll tell you where it’s very simple. danielpackard. com, but I want to be clear who should reach out to us. Logically, [00:56:00] everybody should. Logically, your audience has tried to get rid of this stuff, hasn’t gotten rid of it. It’s not your fault. The experts set you up for failure. It’s not your fault.
Logically, a system that’s designed to get you free of this, where you only pay at the end when you get results, Where there’s no risk to try it, that’s a no brainer. However, that’s logic. And we’re not always logical creatures. People have doubts. They think, who would I be without this? I’ve had it for so long.
Maybe I’m unfixable. Maybe there’s something wrong with me. Maybe I, I don’t deserve. There’s all these unconscious patterns that actually keep people from being healthier and happy. So most people actually won’t reach out for help. But about one in a thousand will. And those people, they have skepticism. I don’t expect people to fully believe me.
They’re going, this sounds good, but I’m still doubtful. Fine. Be skeptical. Don’t believe me. You can’t fully believe me until you go through the program. Our clients go through all the time. And like they said, I met someone at a party. They swore by what you did. It was no risk to try. So I did it. [00:57:00] And then about week one, they go, Oh my God, this is real.
So you can be skeptical, but the people that work with us are motivated. They are motivated because they’re tired of living like this and they want that best life. So if you have anxiety and you’re managing it, it’s better. You can avoid things that make you anxious. But man, what if you could be free of it?
What if you woke up every morning feeling calm? What if you woke up every morning looking forward to the day and not worried about what was going to make you anxious? If that sounds good to you, we do that every day. We can get you that in six weeks. Come find us If you’re a procrastinator and you’re managing it, okay, you’re okay, you’re not gonna get fired But you know, you’re not being productive You know, you’re not enjoying you’re leaving things to the last minute which makes things stressful which and you bring it home But also you’re just not making as much money because you guys get paid to produce and procrastination tells you What if you didn’t procrastinate and you enjoyed your work more?
You got more work done and you could be free of it If you want that we help people with [00:58:00] that Every day, six weeks, the perfectionism. It’s horrible. And lawyers have it because you’re in a, in a job with all these rules and regulations where there’s a certain amount of like, you got to, you kind of got to get close to whatever perfect is.
But then of course, there’s a lot of fear under that, that becomes limiting. So you want to be precise and strategic, but not afraid to make a mistake because that cripples you. So what if you could be a lawyer, be precise, be focused, but not be so afraid to make a mistake. You’d enjoy work more. You’d get more work done.
You’d be sharper. You would innovate. You would grow faster and you’d be a better, more productive lawyer and person. If you want to be free of that perfectionism six weeks, people pleasers, which lawyers are because many lawyers are people of service. You like to be of service and help. That’s great. But if there’s fear underneath the service, now you’re a people pleaser, which means you’re putting yourself last and that’ll catch up with you in your relationships and your life.
If you would like to still be of service to [00:59:00] people, your family and your clients, but know how to put yourself first, make yourself a priority so you can be happier and healthier and help others at a higher level. You know how to put yourself first and take care of yourself so you can be happier six weeks and especially low confidence.
It’s rampant among lawyers because you guys are successful. And part of success is that, Ooh, maybe I’m afraid I’m not good enough, but if I’m successful and smart and capable, I’m more lovable and you attach your performance to your value that motivates you to be good at what you do, but then it can be limiting because now you need people to like you.
You need to be seen as successful versus just wanting to be successful. So what if you could be a lawyer where you didn’t? Need people to approve of you. You didn’t need people to see you a certain way. And that frees you up to be more authentic, to take more risks, to maybe do something you truly want to do, not just what people validate you for, so you can get to [01:00:00] the next level, make way more money and be happier.
If you would like to get that in six weeks, we can get you that. So what you do is you go to DanielPackard. com and there’s two options, both of which you get to talk to me for free. The Danimal, yours truly, which I don’t know, I’d want to talk to me. And there’s two options. We have a free next steps call, which is where you tell me what you’re struggling with and what you want.
And then I’ll just give you some quick actionable steps that’ll move you in the right direction of lowering the fear so that the funky five are going down. Or if you’re like, screw that. I don’t want, I don’t want like tips. I want, I want this gone. You can go to the website, danielpacker. com. And there’s information on the six week program, how it’s set up, how it’s structured, what’s expected of you, the price, which trust me is way less than you’d think, given what you’re getting, you learn about our no change, no charge guarantee.
And then it’s real. There’s testimonials of people who used to be completely trapped and now are [01:01:00] free. And if you’re interested in the program, you book a free quick call with me and we talk. You can ask questions, tell me your concerns, but also I am making sure this is a good fit for you because we don’t let people do the program if it won’t work, because if you try something and it fails, you feel worse about yourself.
And I know that pain and I don’t, we don’t want people to feel worse. Now it works for pretty much everybody. But I do like to double check because while we want you to succeed, we really don’t want you to fail and add to your pain and hopelessness. We’re here to give people hope. So that’s part of that call.
So again, you want to keep managing this stuff for the rest of your life, then you probably won’t come to our website, but for the motivated people that are tired of living like this and are motivated enough to take action, take action. Go to danielpacker. com, book a free call. It’s free. It’s pretty simple.
Have a free call to find out if it’s a good fit for you.
LAUREN: Wonderful. This has been so great. I so appreciate your time and explaining all this and breaking it down in a way [01:02:00] that actually does feel doable and that there would be results. And so I’m certainly going to continue to marinate on this conversation for some time.
And I just want to thank you for your time and service in this space and helping folks finally break free of this cycle, which I know I have suffered from, and I know a lot of my colleagues have. So it’s just so lovely to know someone who is really dedicated their lives to helping others.
DANIEL: Thank you. And just one more thing, lawyers are important and lawyers are needed.
But as you know, the people that make an impact in the world, we need them as healthy as possible. You’re out there on the front lines of humanity and how you show up matters. And I’m sure your audience sees unethical people. The point is how you show up, Matt, you’re impacting and sometimes literally saving lives.
And so your audience has the intelligence, the work ethic, the knowledge. But just the better a person you can be [01:03:00] more empathetic, more confident, kinder, more productive, you’re going to be able to impact the world. More and we built this program to make an impact and one of the ways we make impact Is getting these tools into the people that we that make an impact and lawyers make an impact I know you guys get a bad rap I appreciate you very much because I believe the law while not perfect is beautiful And needed and we want not more lawyers in the world.
We want more good caring lawyers in the world So it i’m sure most of your audience You Is good, but if you want to be even better, more empathetic, more kind, just better to make more impact in the world and what you’re already doing, that’s part of our mission and we would love to help you get that.
LAUREN: Absolutely. Thank you so much for your time today.
DANIEL: You’re very welcome. I’m
LAUREN: over here giving you a virtual high five because you just finished another episode of a different practice. For more from this episode, head [01:04:00] over to a different practice.com/podcast for the show notes. If you found this episode helpful, I’d love it if you’d share it with someone who might like it too.
Be sure to rate the show wherever you listen to podcasts and don’t forget to subscribe so you never miss an episode. If you’re ready to unleash your firm’s potential, grab your free guide to the six pillars of optimization today. I have tried everything and made all the mistakes in building my business over the last near decade.
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